Getting to Know Dr. David Ley, Ph.D., CST-S
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Your SHA Board Member, Clinical Supervisor & Presenter
“I love the transformative power of sexual self-acceptance.”
The Sexual Health Alliance (SHA) is centered around providing Provocative Dialogue and Radical Collaboration. What does radical collaboration look like for you?
Talking about the aspects of sexuality that aren’t nice, polite, proper, or moral. Opening up dialogues about masturbation, infidelity, rough sex, and all those sexual secrets we keep hidden. It’s radical because we are about destroying the suppressive power of sexual shame and increasing self-acceptance, even when your sexual desires are things you’ve been told are “bad”.
Tell us about your journey into the field of sex and sexuality.
My last name is “Ley.” Rhymes with “lay.” What choice did I have? Ha! Really – I started working with sex offenders, and found that there is such a high level of sexual ignorance in the mental health field, that I got lots of referrals and requests for work with non-offenders, just because I had learned the power of not shaming.
What books are you reading right now?
I just read Modern Manhood, by Cleo Stiller – excellent exploration of the modern dilemma for men, navigating complicated conversations around manhood. Telling men to hate themselves for being “toxic” men doesn’t work – so what does? I think we need to ask that question a LOT more.
You’ve written a few books yourself, one of which was The Myth of Sex Addiction. Can you tell us a bit about what inspired you to write this book?
There was one little part in my first book, Insatiable Wives, where I mentioned that I didn’t believe in sex addiction. At the time, there weren’t many folks, aside from Marty Klein, who were questioning the sex addiction narrative in the public media (there’s lots of criticism in academics, but it didn’t filter into the mainstream). That one little comment was seized on by the media, and so I decided to follow it. At first, I was exploring whether it was possible that sex could be an addiction, and perhaps I was wrong. Then, it turned into me exploring how damaging and moralistic this concept really was.
What are the most important values you carry as a sexpert?
I don’t know all the answers. I know my scope. I try to be aware of my biases, and go to the research, to data, and to nonjudgmental clinically sound approaches, so that I can distinguish myself from sexperts who “know it all” and are happy to tell you why you’re a sick pervert who needs treatment.
Who and/or what is your biggest sexual influence/role model?
I’m blessed to have so many. In literature, in media, in our field. One that I’m talking about these days is George Michael, from Wham! In the early ’90s, before he was out as gay, he got caught having sex in a NY bathroom and claimed he was a sex addict. But then, over time, he came out as gay. About ten years later, he was again caught having bathroom sex, in London I believe. But this time, when the media tried to shame him, he said, essentially, “there’s nothing wrong with me or this behavior, it’s a part of gay culture, fuck off!” I love the transformative power of sexual self-acceptance that he demonstrates.
You have a lot of experience talking about sex in the media, what is your advice for approaching sexual topics to people who aren’t knowledgeable on the subject?
Always remember the power of shame, self-hatred, and fear that sexual topics bring up. I have learned to use a lot of humor to make it easier to have hard conversations. I’ve also learned that if I can demonstrate acceptance of myself as a vulnerable, flawed human being who is trying to express integrity and self-compassion, it makes it easier for people to hear my messages, even when they are challenging. I was on The Daily Show once, talking about masturbation, and it was a unique opportunity to combine those strategies.
How do you feel media and technology have impacted the current culture around sexuality?
They’ve thoroughly broken down the ability of people to be successfully shamed into thinking they are the “only one” with sexual thoughts that are outside “the norm.” Now, you can get on the internet, and quickly find that there are millions of other people who share the sexual thoughts you’ve been told make you a deviant. It’s why we have such a flood of people now willing to express that they’re not actually totally straight, or that their interest in kink is normal. We now know that “normal” is actually much, much broader a category than we ever believed.
What are the most important lessons you’ve learned throughout your career?
That it really sucks to be alone, challenging these issues. When I first started questioning sex addiction, I was completely by myself, getting attacked, and threatened. That was very scary. As I have developed good connections with other clinicians and researchers, and we’ve grown a larger community that is pushing back against sexual shame, it has made it a lot less lonely.
What’s your favorite place you’ve traveled for work and why?
A few years ago, a tv show in Australia called me up and asked if I could help them find someone in the southern hemisphere of the planet, who was asking the kinds of questions I was. I said, “Gee, I’m sorry, but at this point, it’s really just me!” So they flew me down to Sidney for a week. It was pretty freaking cool.
WANT MORE DAVID LEY? CATCH HIM TEACHING VIRTUALLY WITH SHA Saturday, March 27TH & Sunday, March 28th ON Modern Sexual Issues in Therapy & Education!
Dr. David J. Ley is a world-renowned clinical psychologist, known for bringing scientifically-accurate and clinically sound information to discussions about modern sexuality.
He serves on the board of the Sexual Health Alliance as an expert advisor and is an internationally-recognized expert on issues related to sexuality, pornography and mental health.
He has appeared on television with Anderson Cooper, Katie Couric, Dr. Phil and others. He has been interviewed in publications ranging from the New York Times, Washington Post, LA Times and the London Telegraph, to Playboy and Hustler magazines. Dr. Ley has published extensively in both the academic and “pop” realms of literature. His latest book, Ethical Porn for Dicks, A Man's Guide to Responsible Viewing Pleasure has endorsements from Dan Savage and Pornhub.com and is a humorous and provocative handbook for men who want to think more comprehensively about porn.
The Myth of Sex Addiction (2012) and Insatiable Wives (2009) were revolutionary explorations of sexual issues which blended a powerful client-centered narrative with a rich understanding of psychology, biology and sociology.
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